Morality in childhood quizlet
what is the significance of the hippocratic oath
"do no harm;" one of the oldest ethical standards that originated in Greece
What is Affective empathy
"emotional" empathy Sharing others' emotions Deficient in psychopathy (don't care about hurting others) Spared in autism (feel appropriate response to others' emotional distress)
Describe the main points of Jeremy Bentham (In class review)
(18th-19th century): Utilitarianism, actions should be judged by their consequences, maximum happiness for as many people as possible
John Bowlby
(19th - 20th century): Attachment Theory- emotional attachment; babies are biologically predisposed (innate and built in) to seek a care giver, influenced by Harlow's baby rhesus monkeys, the three types are: A= Insecure Avoidant B= Secure C= Insecure ambivalent resistant
Charles Darwin
(19th century): Evolution theory- natural selection, survival of the fittest, common decent from an early ancestor, multiplication of the species
Robertsons
(20th cent.): created a film where they watched a 2 year old who went to hospital and while her basic needs were being met, she had no comfort or emotional touch and this prevented her forming an emotional bond with a caretaker
Frans de Waal
(20th cent.): worked with apes and bonobos; primatologist; looked at empathy and fairness; genetic, biological basis in apes who are linked to us ancestrally that they have the emotional capabilities to feel fairness and empathy → link this to child moral development by extrapolation of findings
Lawrence Kohlberg (HE WILL BE ON EXAM)
(20th century ): another stage theorist who based his off of Piaget; focused on cognitive development; more elaborative theoretical framework; three levels/6 stages→ LEVEL 1: PRECONVENTIONAL--> 1. Punishment and Obedience 2. instrumental/self-interest orientation LEVEL 2: CONVENTIONAL--> 3. Good girl vs bad girl 4. Law and order LEVEL 3: POST CONVENTIONAL--> 5. Social contract 6. Universal ethical principals -→ may be asked one question on a level or stage not have to list them all out
Jean Piaget
(20th century): Swiss developmental psychologist who came up with cognitive developmental stage theory: 1.Sensory motor: primitive development, learning the basics their body e.g. sucking the thumb, using a pacifier 2: pre-operational:symbolic play and manipulation of symbols 3: Concrete Operational: able to incorporate deductive logic 4: Formal Operational: able to think abstractly and hypothetical, juggle opposing concepts (children who have learning or intellectual disability will struggle with this greatly)
Grusec
(20th): socialization and parenting; she has 5 sections to her theoretical model→ DOMAIN THEORY → Hierarchical parenting style is linked with control
Brad Bushman
(21st cent.)- in regards to media; three main effects of watching violent media which are: 1. Aggressor effect 2. Fear of Victimization 3. Conscience Numbing/Desensitization
Immanuel Kant
(enlightenment): philosopher// deontology: (the normative ethical position that judges the morality of an action based on the action's adherence to a rule or rules); categorical imperative (a way of evaluating motivations for action); the golden rule); 19th century
Explain nature vs nurture development debate
1. Empiricist: We are born "blank slates." Moral principles are learned as a result of our experiences with family, religious leaders, society and culture. Morality is expected to vary across cultures. 2. Nativist; Humans are born with a moral sense It is given to us by God, or based in evolved psychological and neurobiological mechanisms Morality is universal
Main points of Jonathan Haidt: religion is a team sport
1. Gods are used as tools that allows communities to be cohesive and to flourish 2. Religion is no the root of evil 3. Fundamental nationalism and extreme groupism that stems from religion in a cultural context; religion doesn't always produce or cause it
Main Points for South park & Guns video
1. Guns don't solve problems, people do 2. video addresses moral issues on how easily a child has access/exposure to guns and gun culture in general in america
Main points on Paul Bloom: Are babies born evil?
1. Infants are born with a biological moral foundation that allows them to determine right from wrong at a young age 2. the culture and society that they grow up in is also going to have a large impact on their developing morality 3.testing them as young as 6 months, possibly 3 months being the youngest
Explain deference of gratification and experiment associated
1. It is self control 2. Marshmallow study showed that kids who could wait for the marshmallow were often more successful in life
Main points of Jonathan Haidt: The emotional dog and its rational tail
1. Moral emotions and intuitions drive moral reasoning just as a dog wags its tail 2. Consciousness occurs automatically and people have a hard time describing their moral reasoning when prompted 3. Reasoning is not a reliable mechanism to prove a moral judgement (post hoc rationalization) 4. Children are less able to justify moral actions because of cognitive limitations 5. children are cognitively limited and their are responses are completely emotional/innate
Main points of Howard and Decety: the role of Affect in the Neurodevelopment of Morality
1. Neuroscience suggests that specific neural networks are the foundation of moral reasoning--> the amygdala and the ventral medial prefrontal cortex (hot cognition) 2. Children's moral judgements tend to focus on easily easily imaginable outcomes, but later they can integrate TOM into their moral attitudes and behaviors--> not all kids can think ahead
What are the four spheres of normative child development
1. Physical: Appearance can be very deceptive Physical maturity & psychological maturity do not correlate 2. social: Social factors associated with moral development & with delinquency Full moral development in adult life not childhood 3. cognitive/intellectual: Average I.Q. does not mean mature judgment 4. emotional: Mid to late teens for development of emotional maturity, self control, deferring gratification, insight, empathy, remorse etc
Main points for Paul Bloom: how do morals change?
1. Reason from debate and deliberation allows moral beliefs to evolve and change over time 2. Language dialogue can be used to provoke empathy and disgust--> in terms of what children are exposed to can affect how they develop moral beliefs (slavery; hitler)
Main Points for Paul Bloom: Religion, morality and evolution
1. Religion does not effect our morality; the community based around religion has a bigger impact on children's developing morality 2. We tend to make sacrifices/altruistic behavior for the community that we are in--> children can adapt from this if they grow up in positive religious communities yes or no?
Main points for debate between Professor Richard Dawkins (athiest) and Rabbi Jonathan Saks
1. debate the issue of science and religion 2.disagreements on how kids should be raised--> does raising a child in a faithful community cause them to ask good question? Or is it more like "forcing" a child what to believe" and should be considered wicked, child abuse? 3. Why does the Universe exist--> Rabi says that God created it, Dawkins says asking why is not a legitimate question
Main points of Rubin: peer relationships in childhood
1. early temperament can be indicative of future personality 2. Peer relationships are so important in a child's development so their experience with peers will have a very important influence on their development besides parenting 7. good friendships leads to the development of positive social skills and psychological adjustment; friendlessness and peer rejection leads to psychological distress and the lack of social strategies
Main points in Relations among CU traits, psychopathological symptoms and cognitive and affective morality judgements
1. empathy may be more innate than cognitive morality 2. LDs play a large role in offending behaviors 3. Affective morality is the ability to feel empathy 4. cognitive morality is the ability to determine right from wrong 5. Children with high CU traits (lack of empathy) and externalizing behavioral symptoms are more likely to develop future risk of problems such as demonstrating offending behavior or psychopathology
how are psychopathic traits labeled in childhood
Callous unemotional traits; conduct disorder, ODD
What does the DLPFC regulate
Cool cognition: intelligence, reasoning, control of behavior, regulation of emotion
Describe Utilitarianism and who was associated with it
Jeremy Bentham; focuses on... -Actions should be judged by their consequences alone - Act always in the way that will bring about the greatest total good (happiness) - the greatest good for the greatest number. - Actions are not judged on their motives, only on their outcomes - "The ends justify the means" - Sociocentric/collectivist -
what is indicative of physical brain injury
LOC (loss of consciousness) during TBI (traumatic brain injury)
what is the conventional level and which stages lie in it
Level 2: Conventional: Right and wrong determined by social rules and obligations. Stage 3: Good Boy/Nice Girl. Do good to please others and to obtain approval. Stage 4: Law and Order. Doing one's duty extends beyond immediate relationships to society. Morality is maintaining social order.
what is the post conventional level and which substages lie in it
Level 3: Post-conventional: Morality involves upholding personal moral principles of rights and justice. Stage 5: Social Contract. Recognizes difference between moral and legal rules; rules that are unjust should be changed via democratic process. Stage 6: Universal Ethical Principles. Right and wrong determined by personal reflection to reach impartial principles like Categorical Imperative.
Describe the dual systems model
Two brain systems compete for control of behavior: System 1 involves automatic, "hot," emotional processes System 2 involves controlled, "cool," cognitive processes. We can think of much of our behavior as a reflecting the outcome of competition between these competing systems but it's more of a conversation than polorized systems
criticism of piaget's moral stage theory
Underestimated capacities of young children Stages not so distinct? Piaget himself found significant overlap in the different stages - more like phases. Girls less advanced morally? Role of socioeconomic background and culture? Children appear to make different judgments about the legitimacy of rules and punishments depending on whether the rule concerns moral or social conventional violations.
Evolutionary psychology description
Understanding our mental faculties though the same lens - as a product of evolution. We can think of many kinds of behaviors and mental processes/abilities as serving an adaptive, evolutionary function. Morality has evolved in the same way.
What is de waal's Russian doll example
-Empathy is a multilayered phenomenon: Russian Doll (matryoshka) model At the core is emotional contagion, the simplest form of empathy (de Waal called it synchronization in the video). seen in lower mammals (e.g., rodents) More complex forms of empathy, such as consolation behavior and perspective-taking, are built on this core.
How is psychopathy tested?
-Hare's Psychopathy Checklist (PCL): a 20-item inventory of traits and behaviors, completed on basis of semi-structured interview as well as a review of other information (e.g., official records) -Perfect psychopath = score of 40; Clinical psychopath = score > 30
Main Points of Social Categorization and the Formation of Intergroup Attitudes in Children
1. Children form in group bias easily (eg different colored tshirts); they form moral attitudes and judgements based on trivial foundations 2. Innate tendencies of in-group bias in children can lead to more extreme prejudice and bias attitudes in the future
Main Points for De waal: the Antiquity of empathy
1. Contemporary model of conscious empathy is based on TOM, but these can be considered inaccurate or outdated 2. Looking at cognitive models of empathy triggers biological reward responses 3. Empathy is a subconscious/biological response 4. Children develop empathy and morality earlier than TOM is developed
Describe Frontotemporal dementia
cardiovascular related; patients exhibit a loss of empathy and sociopathic behavior; a loss of skill at all levels (cognitive, motor, bodily functions); no known cure but there are life styles that have been shown to ward off dimension
relatioship bw body and brain development
Brain development occurs alongside bodily development which it helps to co-ordinate through various developmental stages. There is feedback between the brain and the body as development occurs or when it is delayed - Bodily 'developmental delay' e.g. speech delay, is linked to the part of the brain responsible for speech (i.e. Broca's area) or other functions which may in turn be structurally or functionally impaired
describe social development
By ages 6-10 years old most children have developed considerable social skills They will still communicate through play which will become collaborative They have moved from a more egocentric stage of development to taking an interest in others' behaviours, feelings and thought processes They are still struggling with complex abstract ideas and they lack the ability to take a long term view of life
what is the definition of ethics
the science of morals
What is morality
the set of customs, standards, values and codes of conduct that differentiate right and wrong actions, intentions, and decisions
how are physical development charts used in courts
they can show neglect and emotional and physical deprivation but this can get complicated bc of genetics and heredity that make them outliers
what is the down side of "milestones"
they place people in strict boxes
What characteristics are common among CU children?
- Have difficulty identifying emotions in others - particularly fear and sadness - have difficulty making eye contact - refuse to follow orders or instructions from a young age (eg will refuse to sit on a 'naught step')
Describe origins attachment theory--> who discovered it, what it is, etc
- John Bowlby - He sought to understand the distress experienced by infants separated from their parents;Thought that repeated separation experiences were extremely damaging for the mental health of the child; sought an evolutionary explanation
Describe Harlow's monkeys experiment and what they discovered
- Meeting infant's nutritional needs is not enough, infants require physical contact - closeness and affection. -Monkeys raised by surrogate mothers -Emphasized the importance of bonding - a responsive and caring relationship between parent and child. -Children need not only food, warmth and safety but also love, affection and acceptance. -Without this, they will grow up unable to properly care about others, even their own children. -Female monkeys who had wire/cloth surrogate mothers became negligent or abusive mothers themselves
list some cultural differences
- individualistic vs collectivist societies -religion
what causes CU/Psychopathy?
- malfunction in brain (imagining pain in others does not light up VMPFC as it does in "normal" subjects" Abnormal neural development Abnormal hormonal development (cortisol, oxytocin) Brain injury (fetal alcohol exposure) Genetic effects (parental criminality) Severe abuse/neglect (Child of Rage)
importance of IDs and LDs ?
- often left out in research - higher prevalence of IDs and LDs of children who sexually abuse others and commit offending behaviors--> related to genetic component, attachment relationship, emotional development
Describe the relationship between Nature, Nurture & Resilience
- studies show adverse effects on the developing brain from abuse and neglect on brain structure and brain function -there is also evidence of 'catch up' with brain development when 'nurture' improves - secure attachment speeds up recovery and promotes resilience
What did virtue mean in Greek Narratives
-A good person exhibits the cardinal character virtues temperance(moderation or self-restraint), prudence(with thought and care for the future), fortitude(courage under adversity) and justice(fair and reasonable). -These virtues are essential to the good life and happiness. - disposition to act in the right way
What are attachment behaviors
-Bowlby suggested that attachment behaviors (crying, searching) were adaptive responses to separation from caregiver who provides support, protection and care. -Over evolutionary history, infants who maintained proximity to their caregiver were more likely to survive and reproduce -Attachment behaviors were therefore "designed" by evolution to regulate proximity to attachment figure
Summarize nature vs. nurture in terms of morality
-Innateness is about the extent to which the brain is prewired. But the brain is also plastic, and can be rewired. -Any capacity that evolved through natural selection in the distant past can produce maladaptive behaviors now. -Moral sentiments that exist to motivate care for relatives and our social groups can be modified by cultural learning so that people act in ways that are not necessarily to their genetic/reproductive benefit. For example, giving money to strangers in another country -Biology influences behavior, but humans have the cognitive capacity to override biological urges
what are the components of emotional development
-Is dependent on several factors including cognitive development, parenting & attachment -Ability to defer gratification -Impulse control -Monitoring own thoughts & behaviour -Understanding the consequences of own behaviour & impact of this on others -Understanding complex abstract ideas such as ambivalence or mixed feelings -Learning to make good moral judgments
When there is a strong moral dilemma what tends to dominate?
-Moral dilemmas are particularly difficult when the two systems are in conflict. -When there is strong conflict emotional intuition tends to dominate - consistent with fact that deontological judgment often trumps the greater good
What is kohlberg's and piaget's overall views of morality development
-Piaget & Kohlberg held that moral knowledge comes from reasoning about one's experience with the world. -Not innate & not learned from authority figures -Children are little scientists and philosophers who self-construct their understanding of morality (empathy, fairness, justice) through their interactions with others. -Figuring it out for themselves is much more effective than direct instruction from parents or teachers
describe Turiel's work
-developed domain theory in an effort to improve on Kohlberg's work; Adopted a more child-friendly methodology...Told kids stories about other kids who broke rules and Asked a series of simple yes or no questions -Found that children as young as 3 years of age don't treat all rules the same: They distinguish between different domains -
Main Points of "Nature and Nurture in own race face processing"
1. 3 month olds can discriminate bw own race and other race faces 2. The ability to do this may be based on racial characteristic features and shows that own race face reference is present in 3 month old, but only if living in a racially homogeneous environment.
Main points for Gibson: Effects of surveillance reality TV on physical aggression?`
1. Aggressive reality TV shows elicit more aggression in viewers more so than non aggressive reality tv or crime dramas 2. The dangers in watching aggressive reality TV shows is due to the adoption of the aggressive and negative character traits of the characters on the shows during development during childhood
Main points of J Grusec: socialization processes in the family: social and emotional development
1. Children adopt moral values through socializing with others (peers and parents) 2. For socialization to be the most effective, they need parents who set rules but also who are accepting (authoritative leads to the best outcomes because it is the most facilitating)
List and describe Darwin's 5 main concepts of evolution
1. natural selection:- Those with favorable traits have more offspring and their descendants survive longer than others - i.e. Survival of the Fittest 2. survival of the fittest: outcome driven by the differential reproduction success of individual organisms; heritable characteristics that are associated with greater reproductive success 3. common decent from an early ancestor: evolution like a tree 4. multiplication of the species: An enormous number of Species 5.Concept of Gradualism - Adaptive Radiation - Finches--> organisms appear design to suit their environment
list kohlberg's moral levels
1. pre conventional 2.conventional 3. post Conventional
Describe the evolved moral capacitites: 1.Empathy: 2. Anger, disgust: 3. Shame, guilt: 4. Judgment/self-consciousness: 5. Embarrassment: 6. Indignation
1.we care about what happens to others 2.we punish/avoid uncooperative others 3.we punish ourselves for being uncooperative 4.we attend to how people treat others and modify our behavior accordingly. We also gossip. 5.when we fail to cooperate, we show we are sorry 6.we are inclined to punish antisocial others, even when we are not directly affected by their actions
Main points from chapter 7 piaget kohlberg, gilligan and others on moral development
2. Piaget and Kolberg say kids can develop their own moral reasoning through different stages 3.Skinner believes in moral conditioning 4. Bandura believes that morality is learned through social learning/observation 5. Stages are a good guide to when children develop morality 6. There is more to it than what these thinkers suggest, but their theories provide the framework for current research
Mary Ainsworth
20th Century; she actually came up with the types of attachment based on John Bowlby's work; Strange situationparadigm;
what are traits of psychopathy
A psychiatric disorder characterized by: shallow emotional responses diminished capacity for empathy or remorse increased likelihood of antisocial behavior poor behavioral control lack of moral emotions (guilt, shame, empathy); deficient conscience development; don't care about emotions of others intact intellectual capabilities
What area of the brain lights up when viewing painful and unfair images?
Areas more active when viewing painful pictures overlapped with regions that activate when you experience pain yourself, including the insula Unfair offers light up the insula, associated with anger, disgust and autonomic arousal - amygdala was activated by unfair offers. -Also showed a sex difference - males activated their amygdala to a much greater degree to unfair offers
What are piaget's 3 moral stages
At each developmental stage, children engage in new forms of social relationships and their thinking about moral rules changes: 1. Premoral (< 7 years) 2. Heteronomous Morality (transitional period; 7-10 years) 3. Autonomous Morality (>10 years)
Elliot Turiel
Domain theory (proposes that moral reasoning is distinct from other forms of social knowledge, such as societal and psychological knowledge) - specificity in social interactions
Describe turiel's domain theory
Domains of social knowledge: -Moral Issues: harm, welfare, and fairness -Social-Conventional Issues: customs, tradition, and social norms. For example, modes of dress, table manners, greetings. -Personal Issues: privacy, bodily integrity and control, choices and preferences. For example, choice of friends and recreational activities. - children as young as three of four treated moral transgressions as most important
What are the 3 domains of ICU
ICU= inventory of callous unemotional traits 1. callousness 2. uncaring 3. unemotional
Describe Frans de Waal's findings with the capuchin monkeys
FAIRNESS! -The capuchin experiment suggests that these monkeys have expectations about fairness. This implies they:have norms regarding fair distribution, can compare the rewards they receive with those available and those received by others, can compare their own efforts with those of others, experience negative emotions when these comparisons contradict their expectations about fairness. -also provides evidence that they experience social emotions homologous to human moral outrage (unfairness/inequity).
Describe the origins of empathy in animals
For animals, the primary driving fore is self care and well being bc without this they won't survive and preproduce
describe Greene's Dual Process theory:
Greene proposes that the same two competing systems are involved in moral judgment and behavior. System 1 (automatic hot emotional processes) brings about deontological moral judgments (based on rights and duties) System 2 (controlled cool cognitive processes) brings about utilitarian judgments (the greater good)
What does the VMPFC regulate
HOT cognition: emotions, desires, gut feelings (amygdala)
Harry Harlow
Harlow's baby Rhesus monkeys; the babies preferred a cloth mother that provided comfort over a wire mother who provided food; unethical but groundbreaking discoveries
Describe Deontology and who is associated with it
Immanual Kant; focuses on... - Focus on duty, and the rightness or wrongness of actions independent of their outcomes - The Categorical Imperative: An action is right if the person would will that the rule governing it be a universal rule. - Act in such a way that you treat humanity, whether in your own person or in the person of any other, never merely as a means to an end, but always at the same time as an end. -Motive is central. -The Golden Rule - do unto others... -Individualist - personal moral code
What type of behavior is best to study in animals?
Instead of looking for evidence of selfishness, dominance, and aggression, we can looks for signs of cooperation, caring and empathy. And there's actually lots of good evidence of this in the animal kingdom. one really good example is what's known as consolation behavior.
What was frans de waal interested in observing?
Interested in whether the emotions and cognitive abilities that underlie moral behaviors, e.g. empathy and a sense of fairness are present in our closest relatives, the apes, as well as in more distant relatives, such as old‐world and new‐world monkeys.
Joshua Green
Moral tribes; spoke about the example of herders who grow herds of animals on a hillside and within the different tribes some are cooperative and others are competitive. He described differences between the survival abilities of the cooperative vs competitive herders. Cooperative don't waste energy by fighting, they have bigger brains (prefrontal lobe) bc these deal with making judgments, decisions and thinking and feeling. Cooperation offers a competitive advantage. This transfers into real life by working in TEAMS in every profession. Cooperative teams will have an advantage and produce a better and more effective product or result.
How did piaget reach his conclusions
Naturalistic Observations of Child Play and the interview technique. He told children stories about moral transgressions. He then asked questions like whether the children were guilty, which child was naughtier, and why.
Importance of Peer interactions to moral development according to piaget
Parents and other grown-ups can act as obstacles to moral development: requiring obedience to parental rules is not how children learn to be moral. Children's understanding of morality is constructed out of social interactions and the intrinsic consequences of those interactions - to learn to be moral, children have to have opportunities to play and interact with other kids, without adult intervention. IT's hard for a child to see things from a parent or teacher's POV, because they've never been a parent or teacher.
Why does Haidt suggests that we have such passion for sports and other expressions of group allegiance?
Our moral minds were designed to unite us into groups (teams) and divide us against other teams (Us vs. Them).
what is the pre conventional level and which stages are in it
Pre conventional: Right and wrong determined by punishment and rewards; morality is external. Stage 1: Punishment/Obedience. "Might makes right." Do good to avoid punishment Stage 2: Instrumental Relativist. "What's in it for me?" Do good to be rewarded.
What are the evolutionary advantages of a sense of fairness
Recognizing when you receive less than a partner tells you that the benefits of cooperation may be in danger. Protesting against this situation (inequity aversion - IA) helps restore the cooperative relationship and its benefits.
true or false: children are emotionally driven
TRUE; deferral of gratification (marshmallow example)
What is rationalism
The answers to moral decisions can be reached by reason and logic. Children's moral development is self-constructed, they figure it out for themselves.
what does empathy in non primate species indicate
The evidence suggests that these animals are sensitive to the emotions of others, and in some cases, motivated to do something to ameliorate the other individual's state.
What is the most basic empathetic and caring relationship?
The most basic other-caring relationship is that of a parent and its offspring. -Mammals are defined by the fact that they nourish their young with milk. Requires exquisite sensitivity to the needs of and strong caring for highly dependent offspring All forms of human prosocial and moral behavior thought to have roots in this basic attachment (xytosin hormone is used for breastfeeding in mothers and is attributed to "feel good" and loving emotions
Are children and adolescents driven more by hot or cold cognition?
We can expect young children, adolescents, and even young adults to be more driven by their "hot" cognitive systems -evolutionarily older parts of the brain develop first (appetitive, reward-driven) -parts of the brain responsible for higher-level cognitive abilities (intelligence, control over behavior, emotion regulation) develop late (into the 20's)
How did Darwin come up with his approach
detailed observations of natural phenomena; based off of 19th cent. scientific knowledge which was the emerging science of genetics; he paid little consideration to individual psychological factors was more interested in group psychology (survival of the fittest)
Jonathan Haidt:
his theory surrounded moral development(stage theory) : 5 moral values→ 1. Harm/Care 2. Fairness/Reciprocity 3. In-group Loyalty/A4. Authority/Respect 5. Purity/Sanctity
Paul Bloom:
moral development specifically in babies; he thinks that babies have an innate sense of morality but looks at environmental influences: religion and culture (parenting styles, language and literature)
Richard Dawkins vs. Sacks
religious debates; Jewish religion (rabbi) vs atheism/science
What is animal ethology
study of animals in their environmental context ad their development; occurred largely after WWII where a lot of soldiers experienced severe PTSD
what part of the brain is particularly important to morality
ventromedial prefrontal cortex; people with damage to this area often lack empathy and display poor social behavior
do psychopaths understand right from wrong?
yes they do, they just don't care.
Does cooperation lead to better outcomes? Who talks about this?
yes. Collaboration and socialization is beneficial. Green discusses this in terms of herders. The more cooperative and collaborative ones do better because they can come together and not waste time fighting and arguing.
